G1 & G1+M Firmware Issue - Line Crossing?

[JB1970]

I came across an issue with line crossing some months ago and thought it was a one off with one of my cameras or the NVR. Unfortunately I've now discovered the same problem exists in other cameras with the G1 and G1+M firmware.

The issue is that the A and B direction on the line crossing gets reversed and does not behave as expected. I first found this with a DS2CD2385-FWD-I running V5.6.x firmware connected to a DS7608NI-K2/8P NVR running 3.4.104 firmware.

I've now found the same issue again. This time it's a DS2CD2346G1 (Acusense 4MP turret) with firmware V5.6.4 connected to a DS7616NI-I2/16P running V4.22.005 firmware.

I've attached pictures showing the issue. The NVR local GUI and Camera web GUI shows A above the line and B below whereas the NVR web GUI shows it the other way round. It seems to "flip" the A & B sides once you rotate the line passed a certain angle of rotation, but this isn't matched throughout the local, web and camera GUI so you end up with a mismatch.

So which is correct......

 

[Dan]

This is not an issue we have seen before, we just tested this ourselves with a 2385 (running v5.6.2) that is connected directly to a 7716-I4 (running v4.22.005). We started with a line down the centre of the live view on a local monitor that had A pointing to the right and B pointing to the left, the same was showing in the web access for the camera and NVR. We then cleared the line and reversed it on the local monitor (e.g. A pointing left / B pointing right) and initially after saving the settings the camera and NVR web access were still showing how it had been set originally, but after we refreshed both the NVR and camera web pages (without saving the settings) the lines had been corrected to match what was set on the NVR local monitor.

We also checked with a remotely connected 2055 (running v5.6.4) which is connected to the same NVR and we saw the same happen, we reversed the line and when we refreshed the web page of both the camera and NVR the line had been flipped. I also tried reversing the line direction in the NVRs web access and after saving I went off and back on to the line crossing page on the local monitor and refreshed the cameras web page and both had been flipped.

It is only when you log directly into the camera and change the event settings there that the changes are not carried across to the NVR web and local access. This because people may be storing event footage locally to the camera using a MicroSD card or are sending event notifications directly from the camera and so they may want different event settings set locally in the camera to those set in the NVR.

 

[JB1970]

This is not an issue we have seen before, we just tested this ourselves with a 2385 (running v5.6.2) that is connected directly to a 7716-I4 (running v4.22.005). We started with a line down the centre of the live view on a local monitor that had A pointing to the right and B pointing to the left, the same was showing in the web access for the camera and NVR. We then cleared the line and reversed it on the local monitor (e.g. A pointing left / B pointing right) and initially after saving the settings the camera and NVR web access were still showing how it had been set originally, but after we refreshed both the NVR and camera web pages (without saving the settings) the lines had been corrected to match what was set on the NVR local monitor.

We also checked with a remotely connected 2055 (running v5.6.4) which is connected to the same NVR and we saw the same happen, we reversed the line and when we refreshed the web page of both the camera and NVR the line had been flipped. I also tried reversing the line direction in the NVRs web access and after saving I went off and back on to the line crossing page on the local monitor and refreshed the cameras web page and both had been flipped.

It is only when you log directly into the camera and change the event settings there that the changes are not carried across to the NVR web and local access. This because people may be storing event footage locally to the camera using a MicroSD card or are sending event notifications directly from the camera and so they may want different event settings set locally in the camera to those set in the NVR.

Thanks for checking at your end Dan.

My method for setting up the directly connected cameras is always to set up events either on the local monitor or NVR GUI first - I then log on to the cameras GUI only to make changes that cannot be made via the NVR (min/max object size on NVR 3)

I've just done some more testing and found what's happening - definitely an issue:

NVR WEB GUI
- click "draw area" and a vertical line will appear with A on left B on right
- grab the line at the top and move it through a circle clockwise
- When you reach 90 degrees horizontal A & B will flip so that B is on top A on bottom
- When you reach 270 degrees they will flip back again
- This happens regardless of whether you rotate clockwise or anti clockwise

CAMERA WEB GUI (192.168.254.xxx or via virtual host)
- click "detection area" and a vertical line will appear with A on left B on right
- grab the line at the top and move it through a circle clockwise
- A & B will always stay the same side of the line

So to summarise if you program using the web GUI of the NVR and move a line to the horizontal position and save it, it will be opposite in the camera even after logging into the camera web GUI and refreshing

 

[JB1970]

Thanks for checking at your end Dan.

My method for setting up the directly connected cameras is always to set up events either on the local monitor or NVR GUI first - I then log on to the cameras GUI only to make changes that cannot be made via the NVR (min/max object size on NVR 3)

I've just done some more testing and found what's happening - definitely an issue:

NVR WEB GUI
- click "draw area" and a vertical line will appear with A on left B on right
- grab the line at the top and move it through a circle clockwise
- When you reach 90 degrees horizontal A & B will flip so that B is on top A on bottom
- When you reach 270 degrees they will flip back again
- This happens regardless of whether you rotate clockwise or anti clockwise

CAMERA WEB GUI (192.168.254.xxx or via virtual host)
- click "detection area" and a vertical line will appear with A on left B on right
- grab the line at the top and move it through a circle clockwise
- A & B will always stay the same side of the line

So to summarise if you program using the web GUI of the NVR and move a line to the horizontal position and save it, it will be opposite in the camera even after logging into the camera web GUI and refreshing

So further testing using the local monitor points the problem directly to the NVR web GUI.

On the local output you can't rotate the line - you can only click the start and end point. If you do this the position of A is always left of the first point you click. Checking the result in both NVR web and camera web, the positions of A & B always match the local monitor regardless of the orientation of the line.

So the NVR webpage can't be used for configuring line crossing without the possibility of direction errors.

 

[Dan]

Hi @JB1970

Thank you for the extra information, I think I have identified the issue.

I do most of my work in the office on a Mac and Mac web access currently does not support the same "web components" plug-in that the PC uses and this will explain why I was not seeing the same issue as you.

I just logged into a spare PC we have in the office and installed the plug-in and followed your above instructions in the NVR web access and I saw the A-B reverse as you described.

So I think the issue actually relates to the new plug-in, I will share this forum thread with our contact at Hikvision support and see if they can shine a light on this issue.

 

[JB1970]

Thanks Dan

I'm using Mac as well but have Windows on it via Parallels.

What has me confused is that the issue affects the NVR webpage but not the Camera webpage - I'm assuming the connection to both with Internet Explorer is via the same plugin.

For now, I'll make a mental note to use the local monitor for configuration.

 

[Dan]

Hi @JB1970

I have received a response from Hikvision support and I think I understand how this all works now, it is not an error it is just very confusing.

Hikvision's response was as follows:

"If you change the settings on the recorder it needs to be applied also when you go the web browser and vice versa. If you change settings on the browser, that should change settings "on the local monitor"​

I have asked them to clarify this further but from some more testing I think it basically means that if you change an event setting in web access and save it that will be applied to the local monitor event settings, but if you change settings on the local monitor they will not be applied to the web access. I don't know why Hikvision has it setup this way as it just adds confusion but to avoid any confusion in the future we would just advise that you only change event settings from the web access and not the local monitor.

Also, the reversing of the line crossing direction is another unnecessarily confusing feature. If the line direction is set to <A|B> or <B|A> it doesn't actually make a difference as the event will still trigger if someone moves left to right or right to left, it is just simply a confusing difference in web access software and the local NVR software, I have asked Hikvision to look into this and see if they and iron this difference out to reduce the chance of confusion in the future.

 

[macman]

Well, it's buggy for me too and I don't use an NVR. I set up line crossing on my DS-2CD2543G0-IS [V5.6.3 build 190923] in IE running under emulation on my Mac and it records events in the opposite direction from that which I set up.

That said, all of the motion and smart event settings on this particular camera seem buggy and unpredictable. None of them works properly for me. Even basic motion events are only recorded in one direction.

 

[JB1970]

Hi @JB1970

I have received a response from Hikvision support and I think I understand how this all works now, it is not an error it is just very confusing.

Hikvision's response was as follows:

"If you change the settings on the recorder it needs to be applied also when you go the web browser and vice versa. If you change settings on the browser, that should change settings "on the local monitor"​

I have asked them to clarify this further but from some more testing I think it basically means that if you change an event setting in web access and save it that will be applied to the local monitor event settings, but if you change settings on the local monitor they will not be applied to the web access. I don't know why Hikvision has it setup this way as it just adds confusion but to avoid any confusion in the future we would just advise that you only change event settings from the web access and not the local monitor.

Also, the reversing of the line crossing direction is another unnecessarily confusing feature. If the line direction is set to <A|B> or <B|A> it doesn't actually make a difference as the event will still trigger if someone moves left to right or right to left, it is just simply a confusing difference in web access software and the local NVR software, I have asked Hikvision to look into this and see if they and iron this difference out to reduce the chance of confusion in the future.

Thanks Dan

As you say - very confusing. I'm sure Hikvision have not got the gist of the issue reported with regard to the point of rotation of the line (90 degrees and 270 degrees) where the A & B jump sides, that ONLY occurs in the NVR webpage.

My testing proves that it's actually the total opposite of what they are saying:

- Applying a setting using the local monitor - the correct orientation and settings are reflected in both the NVR and Camera web page
- Applying a setting using the NVR web page - the correct orientation are reflected in both the Camera web page and local GUI but ONLY IF THE LINE IS ORIENTATED BETWEEN 0 & 90 DEGREES or 270 & 360 DEGREES.

I've seen this on multiple camera and recorder models.

 

[Dan]

Thanks for testing further @JB1970

I have informed Hikvision of the 90/180/270 rotation issue and how this is the key thing that is causing confusion, but you and @macman are also right that that accuracy of the line crossing is glitchy and it does seem to stop working correctly when the directions mismatch between the NVR local and web access, I will share this extra information with Hikvision because now from testing further and reading your above information again I can now fully understand why this is an issue for you and other users who are not drawing lines at a 90-degree angles, when you do have the line at 45 degree or similar this causes a mismatch between the GUIs and stops the line crossing from triggering correctly.

Apologies for going round in circles but it is often these small issues that cause the biggest problems but are also the trickiest to explain and get your head around, I will do my best to try and explain this to Hikvision support. (I shared a link to this thread in my first email to them but I don't think they read any of it so I may have to paste some of this text into an email so they actually read it)

 

[Dan]

Quick update on this issue, I passed all the above information to our contact at Hikvision and they came back with this early this morning:

We have replicated the issue on our side and I am waiting for solutions from R&D, will get you updated asap. Thank you very much!​

So Hikvision can now see the issue and their R&D team are working on a fix for the problem.

 

[JB1970]

Quick update on this issue, I passed all the above information to our contact at Hikvision and they came back with this early this morning:

We have replicated the issue on our side and I am waiting for solutions from R&D, will get you updated asap. Thank you very much!​

So Hikvision can now see the issue and their R&D team are working on a fix for the problem.

Excellent that's great news Dan - thanks. Let them know I'll happily accept freebies for finding bugs in their hardware, software and firmware

 

[Dan]

Hikvision support have come back to me quicker than I thought with the new build/repaired firmware. (attached below)

I have tested it on our 7716 NVR here in the office and the line flipping when you rotate through 360 degrees appears to be fixed and when you change the line position from either the local monitor or NVR browser (PC or Mac) that change is copied across to local monitor, NVR browser access, and camera browser access.

If you change the line position when directly accessing the cameras this still does not change the line position in the other points of access, but Hikivision explained this previously that the camera event settings have to be separate from the NVRs because in some situations users may want to record events to local MicroSD storage whilst still having continuous storage set up in the NVR with no events set.

Do test it and let us know how you get on.

 

[macman]

Hopefully they will follow through with a camera firmware update since the NVR fix doesn't help those using only the SD card with no NVR.

 

[JB1970]

Hikvision support have come back to me quicker than I thought with the new build/repaired firmware. (attached below)

I have tested it on our 7716 NVR here in the office and the line flipping when you rotate through 360 degrees appears to be fixed and when you change the line position from either the local monitor or NVR browser (PC or Mac) that change is copied across to local monitor, NVR browser access, and camera browser access.

If you change the line position when directly accessing the cameras this still does not change the line position in the other points of access, but Hikivision explained this previously that the camera event settings have to be separate from the NVRs because in some situations users may want to record events to local MicroSD storage whilst still having continuous storage set up in the NVR with no events set.

Do test it and let us know how you get on.

Thanks Dan. I cam see they've put a specific fixed version in the UK portal. I'll try it on mine now (7616) and report back.

I'm not sure whether they are aware but this definitely also affects the 7608 K2 series as well - I first discovered the issue on my 7608 K2 model before I replaced it with the 7616 I version a month or two ago. May be worth letting them know

 

[Dan]

Hopefully they will follow through with a camera firmware update since the NVR fix doesn't help those using only the SD card with no NVR.

Is this regards to the buggy issue? we don't see any problems adjusting the line position or event settings of the camera on its own.

there is a newer v5.6.4 firmware for the camera you have, it doesn't mention anything about your issue in the release notes but the updates do sometimes bring stability improvements, it may also be IE/PC emulator you are using that is causing the buggy/laggy performance. When we access on a camera on a Mac using Chrome we don't see too much lag, but we have seen very slow load times and buggy menus when using IE tab and old browsers like Sea Monkey.

Hopefully, we will see improvements for Mac browser support in future firmware updates.

 

[Dan]

I'm not sure whether they are aware but this definitely also affects the 7608 K2 series as well - I first discovered the issue on my 7608 K2 model before I replaced it with the 7616 I version a month or two ago. May be worth letting them know

I will pass this on, I think it is only an issue for the K2/K4 version of the firmware because the K1 firmware for the 7604(B) appears to already have fixed this problem.

 

[JB1970]

Hopefully they will follow through with a camera firmware update since the NVR fix doesn't help those using only the SD card with no NVR.

I've not seen that issue - what camera model and firmware version are you using? I'm replacing a few cameras today so can test the one I take down.

 

[JB1970]

I will pass this on, I think it is only an issue for the K2/K4 version of the firmware because the K1 firmware for the 7604(B) appears to already have fixed this problem.

OK - mine was a 7608K2 and I'm sure it was running 3.4.104 when I first discovered it.

 

[JB1970]

Thanks Dan. I cam see they've put a specific fixed version in the UK portal. I'll try it on mine now (7616) and report back.

I'm not sure whether they are aware but this definitely also affects the 7608 K2 series as well - I first discovered the issue on my 7608 K2 model before I replaced it with the 7616 I version a month or two ago. May be worth letting them know

Dan - NOT FIXED!

I've updated the firmware and the same issue persists. Dragging the line passed horizontal flips A & B to opposite sides of the line and if it's applied this is the opposite of what is in the NVR local and camera webpage.

- 7616-I2/16P V4.22.005 March 27th build
- DS-2CD2347G1-L V5.6.4