Event LED linkage firmware - OEM DT387G2 - No option for LED linkage on V5.7.2

[troglegranular]

<code>
Model: DT387G2
Firmware Version: V5.7.2 build 211109
Encoding Version: V7.2 build 21108
Web Version: V4.0.1 build 210924
Plugin Version: 3.0.7.29
Firmware Version Property: B-R-G5-0</code>

As you can see, I've got a G5 edition of the 2387G2 LU. It's an, "OEM model" but supports OEM firmware upgrades. It came with Firmware V5.7.3 on it, and I asked the seller to provide V5.7.2 because I wish to use the LED light linkage option as described here: How-to: - How do I set my Hikvision ColorVu camera's built-in light to turn on during event periods?

Unfortunately, even after downgrading to V5.7.2, I don't have the option in my settings page to enable the LED light upon an event (such as motion detection or line cross, etc).

1. Note that the build version of my firmware is different from the firmware mentioned in the thread I linked above. Is this relevant?
2. I've been told that since I have an OEM device, that I can't use normal firmware and must use OEM provided firmware. Is this true?
3. Is there anything I can do, or anything that the seller could do, which would allow for the LED light to turn on upon an event of some type?
4. Should I just get the LSU models to avoid this for the future, or are they firmware dependent as well in regards to activating the LED light linkage? I'm a little fuzzy on all of the details surrounding Hikvision products. Could someone explain the details between the LU and the LSU models in regards to features (proprietary 2 way audio, active flashing deterrence, anything else)?

All I really want to accomplish is to find a reasonably affordable camera which has good low light performance, preferably with white LED lights now that I've seen what these can do first hand. However, the white LED light preference is explicitly on the stipulation that the lights can be controlled via an event, and not being forced to be on all night long. I'm familiar with the Dahua 5442 series which gets a lot of praise for low light performance for a large sensor, but their white light version doesn't support event based activation like the G2 Hikvisions do.

The LU Hikvision models (such as DS-2CD2387G2-LU) are significantly cheaper for the 8MP lineup as opposed to the LSU model (anywhere from 20-60 dollars difference depending on source), and the price difference would add up over all of the cameras I would eventually buy. I don't plan on using the 2 way audio feature as the LSU's 2 way audio isn't compliant with ONVIF's backchannel standard and I want to avoid Chinese software, so is there any other reason for me to go with the LSU version?

Thank you all so much for your time and help!

 

[JB1970]

Unfortunately, even after downgrading to V5.7.2, I don't have the option in my settings page to enable the LED light upon an event (such as motion detection or line cross, etc).

There are (confusingly) two build versions of 5.7.2. It appears you have the earlier one. There is a specific version with the fix for the white light trigger on event. You can find it here (the third file in the list):

HIKVISION UK PORTAL

www.hikvisioneurope.com

2. I've been told that since I have an OEM device, that I can't use normal firmware and must use OEM provided firmware. Is this true?

I'm not sure on that as I've only ever used genuine Hikvision products.

3. Is there anything I can do, or anything that the seller could do, which would allow for the LED light to turn on upon an event of some type?

No - it's a firmware feature and there's no way to link it otherwise.

4. Should I just get the LSU models to avoid this for the future, or are they firmware dependent as well in regards to activating the LED light linkage? I'm a little fuzzy on all of the details surrounding Hikvision products. Could someone explain the details between the LU and the LSU models in regards to features (proprietary 2 way audio, active flashing deterrence, anything else)?

Yes. I know some people swear by the standard models white light on event feature but I personally don't rate it. If it's on when there's an event you've potentially got unusable images in darkness when there's no event. Also it triggers during daylight - annoying.

LU is the standard model with microphone. (U denotes microphone)
LSU/SL has microphone, speaker, and strobe light as well as an alarm input and output connection. The important thing here is that the white LED used for illumination uses separate LEDs to the strobe light. So you can have perfectly exposed colour images 24/7 while still having a visual alert from the strobe light (and audible from the speaker if desired). They also have two way audio so you can 'talk back' through the camera using Hik-Connect.

If you're using ONVIF rather than a Hikvision backend, there is a company that does a similar active deterrent camera (albeit 5MP) that has both colour and IR illumination. That's the SPRO DHIPD50/28LRW/30-D-V2. Not sure whether that's available in your locality. I've not tried it, so cannot comment on how it would compare.

 

[troglegranular]

There are (confusingly) two build versions of 5.7.2. It appears you have the earlier one. There is a specific version with the fix for the white light trigger on event. You can find it here (the third file in the list):

HIKVISION UK PORTAL

www.hikvisioneurope.com

I'm not sure on that as I've only ever used genuine Hikvision products.


No - it's a firmware feature and there's no way to link it otherwise.


Yes. I know some people swear by the standard models white light on event feature but I personally don't rate it. If it's on when there's an event you've potentially got unusable images in darkness when there's no event. Also it triggers during daylight - annoying.

LU is the standard model with microphone. (U denotes microphone)
LSU/SL has microphone, speaker, and strobe light as well as an alarm input and output connection. The important thing here is that the white LED used for illumination uses separate LEDs to the strobe light. So you can have perfectly exposed colour images 24/7 while still having a visual alert from the strobe light (and audible from the speaker if desired). They also have two way audio so you can 'talk back' through the camera using Hik-Connect.

If you're using ONVIF rather than a Hikvision backend, there is a company that does a similar active deterrent camera (albeit 5MP) that has both colour and IR illumination. That's the SPRO DHIPD50/28LRW/30-D-V2. Not sure whether that's available in your locality. I've not tried it, so cannot comment on how it would compare.

Thank you so much for the reply!

Personally, I don't want strobe lights to activate, and I just want white lights to provide better clarity/lighting for video purposes. So, just to be crystal clear, the LSU/SL model would be adding additional strobe lights and those would be unused by my intended use case, right? The actual illumination white LEDs would be equivalent.

And, also to clarify, does the LSU allow for the illumination white LED lights to activate on all firmware versions, or just on specific versions of firmware like with my LU model?

My interest isn't really in active deterrence per se so much as it is in quality low light performance without moving into Axis tier pricing, haha. The white LEDs provide that option better than the IR cameras do even at equivalent sensor sizes, from what I've seen for close range. The 4MP and 1/1.8" sensors, along with the 8MP and 1/1.2" sensors are really impressive.

Also, about daytime activation, couldn't I set a schedule for this so that the LEDs only activate during night events? It seems like these sorts of things would be obvious to camera companies like Hikvision, and would be designed with this in mind.

I plan on seeing what my OEM seller has to say in regards to the other firmware build of 5.7.2, but if that doesn't work out, I'll see if I can't try that official Hikvision firmware and keep my fingers crossed that I don't brick anything.

Thank you so much for the helpful reply!

 

[JB1970]

And, also to clarify, does the LSU allow for the illumination white LED lights to activate on all firmware versions, or just on specific versions of firmware like with my LU model?

Unfortunately I think the feature isn’t available at all on any firmware version of the LSU model (I’ll check mine but I’m sure that’s the case)

Also, about daytime activation, couldn't I set a schedule for this so that the LEDs only activate during night events?

Again unfortunately not. With LSU/SL you can schedule the strobe and/or audio separately from the event. With the LU (and the specific firmware) you can only schedule your event. One workaround is to use two different event types - one that has the LED action and is scheduled for nighttime and one that doesn’t have the action and is scheduled for daytime. Even that’s not ideal as schedules are set by actual time and can’t follow the Day/Night ‘sensor’, so the varying daylight hours will invariably have it coming on in daylight during the summer months.

 

[troglegranular]

Unfortunately I think the feature isn’t available at all on any firmware version of the LSU model (I’ll check mine but I’m sure that’s the case)

I believe this video demonstrates it working on the LSU/SL models?

Unless I'm missing something, that is.

Again unfortunately not. With LSU/SL you can schedule the strobe and/or audio separately from the event. With the LU (and the specific firmware) you can only schedule your event. One workaround is to use two different event types - one that has the LED action and is scheduled for nighttime and one that doesn’t have the action and is scheduled for daytime. Even that’s not ideal as schedules are set by actual time and can’t follow the Day/Night ‘sensor’, so the varying daylight hours will invariably have it coming on in daylight during the summer months.

I can live with a few hours near dusk and dawn where the LEDs are turning on unnecessarily. I just can't live with zero illumination OR constant white light illumination.

Can events not be set so that each region of detection has its own hours?

Can events be triggered from an NVR in a similar fashion that NVR software can be triggered from FTP uploads from the camera?

 

[JB1970]

I believe this video demonstrates it working on the LSU/SL models?

Unless I'm missing something, that is.


I can live with a few hours near dusk and dawn where the LEDs are turning on unnecessarily. I just can't live with zero illumination OR constant white light illumination.

Can events not be set so that each region of detection has its own hours?

Can events be triggered from an NVR in a similar fashion that NVR software can be triggered from FTP uploads from the camera?

I've not looked at the video but have just had a look at my LSU/SL. there is no 'White Light' linkage as an action, just the 'Flashing Alarm' on the LSU/SL. However the flash frequency can be set to 'normally on' which should do similar. You would switch off the LED illumination but set the flashing light as an action on the event and set the flashing light to 'normally on'

Edit: Just watched the vid which shows the same as what I found.

 

[troglegranular]

I've not looked at the video but have just had a look at my LSU/SL. there is no 'White Light' linkage as an action, just the 'Flashing Alarm' on the LSU/SL. However the flash frequency can be set to 'normally on' which should do similar. You would switch off the LED illumination but set the flashing light as San action on the event and set the flashing light to 'normally on'

View attachment 8039

Yes, that's what the video does.

Is there a limit on the duration that you can set the LED to trigger for?

If a second event occurs, does it reset the timer of the LED light's duration?

 

[JB1970]

Yes, that's what the video does.

Is there a limit on the duration that you can set the LED to trigger for?

If a second event occurs, does it reset the timer of the LED light's duration?

I just tried putting a random duration in and you get a pop up that the allowable range is 1 - 60 minutes.

I would expect each another trigger to restart the time though I've not tried it. It would be unusual if it didn't. The only thing you'd need to be aware of regarding a second event is what analytic you use for your event. Line Crossing and Intrusion are usually favoured over Motion Detection as they're more configurable and you'll get fewer false alerts. However they will only trigger once (moving across the line/dwelling in the intrusion zone) so once someone is in the area, they wouldn't trigger a second alert while they remain present (though another person moving across the line would)

 

[troglegranular]

I just tried putting a random duration in and you get a op up that the allowable range is 1 - 60 minutes.

Excellent!

I would expect each another trigger to restart the time though I've not tried it. It would be unusual if it didn't. The only thing you'd need to be aware of regarding a second event is what analytic you use for your event. Line Crossing and Intrusion are usually favoured over Motion Detection as they're more configurable and you'll get fewer false alerts. However they will only trigger once (moving across the line/dwelling in the intrusion zone) so once someone is in the area, they wouldn't trigger a second alert while they remain present (though another person moving across the line would)

I see, thanks for letting me know. That would be slightly problematic. Do different types of detection all work together and play nicely?

 

[JB1970]

Excellent!

I see, thanks for letting me know. That would be slightly problematic. Do different types of detection all work together and play nicely?

Yeah you can use the different analytics together. Also keep in mind, you can have 4 individual lines in line crossing. So maybe another workaround might be to use a couple of lines in your detection area and set them up bi directional. That would give you some re triggers while movement continues in your detection area.

It's difficult to get a perfect detection setup. AcuSense is good but not perfect. Human shaped shadows can trigger it. I find that a person walking by, but outside of the configured area can trigger it, as they're reflected in the glass windows that are in the configured area. I do occasionally also get some false alerts from animals and birds which is a pain. The two foxes fighting below triggered AcuSense motion the other night (though the line crossing filtered them):

 

[troglegranular]

Yeah you can use the different analytics together. Also keep in mind, you can have 4 individual lines in line crossing. So maybe another workaround might be to use a couple of lines in your detection area and set them up bi directional. That would give you some re triggers while movement continues in your detection area.

Great, that sounds like it'll work.

Alright, final question for the moment - Can I trigger events from a network device that ISN'T the camera, such as a self hosted software NVR using some protocol? Or do all events have to be triggered from the camera itself?

___
In response to your edit, I get a ton of false positives on my current setup so I don't mind a few here and there. I care more about not missing real events rather than seeing a few fakes.

 

[JB1970]

Great, that sounds like it'll work.

Alright, final question for the moment - Can I trigger events from a network device that ISN'T the camera, such as a self hosted software NVR using some protocol? Or do all events have to be triggered from the camera itself?

In some NVRs (I series) there's an option for IoT devices but that just has options for Hikvision, Optex, GJD and Luminate devices and of course there's the wired alarms. I'm not so sure with sending alarms via a network device/software. It may be possible to generate an alarm via some command but I'm not sure. I have seen several integrations for things like Home Assistant but I guess they're more for receiving alarm events from the camera rather than sending to it.

 

[troglegranular]

I figured as much. Alright, well I guess I'll probably end up getting LSU models in the future, then. I can get them at the same price as I can get the official Hikvision LU's, and the way I see it I may as well get the one with more features which isn't firmware bound and has a few extra features as well.

Thank you so much! I may come back with a few more questions, but I think that about wraps up what I had in mind at the moment.

Edit: For the record, I was able to update my "OEM" model with the special firmware build of 5.7.2 and seemingly there are no issues present.

 

[troglegranular]

I just got an LSU/SL model in, and there are two differences that I wasn't aware of (or perhaps forgot):

1. The LSU/SL has a cool white LED as opposed to the warm white from the LU - I'd put ballpark figures of the LSU/SL to be somewhere around 6500k, and the LU around 4000k in color temperature. They're quite distinct. I don't have any scientific method to measure this, and it's certainly possible that I could be mistaking a blue tint for CCT here, however I don't think this is entirely the case.
2. The LSU/SL activates the, "motion detection light" (alarm strobe function set to, "normally on" as discussed above) with one LED (center LED out of 3 total), whereas the LU model activates the, "motion detection light" (firmware specific option) with two LEDs (two out of two).

It should be noted that if we presume the same LED is in use for both models, just with a different CCT in each, that the single LSU's will put out more lumens than a single LU's due to efficiency differences which are prevalent in color temperature changes, given how LEDs function. However, this efficiency discrepancy isn't enough to make it so that the single LSU's is still going to be brighter than two LU LEDs. CRI is also an important consideration, but I doubt they are significantly different between the two LEDs if we're presuming them to be the same emitter.

I may strongly consider buying more LU models since it seems like they'll give me a brighter light in the use case I have in mind. I'll have to take my LSU/SL and LU outside at night, and just test them side by side to see if the difference is significant.

 

[Dan]

Hi @troglegranular

I think I understand where there is some confusion here.

You say you tested motion triggering the central deterrent light on the LSU model and compared it to the 2 illumination lights on the LU model, but these perform different functions so should not be compared.

The 2 outer LEDs on the LSU model should also be the same warmer illumination LEDs as the LU model, so the LSU model should be configured for the warm LEDs to come on the same way as the LU model and then have the flashing central deterrent LED come on with event triggers.

Using the LSU model makes more sense in scenarios where the warm lights are going to stay on all night and then the extra bright central light stands out against the warm light like in this demo video.

 

[troglegranular]

Hi @troglegranular

I think I understand where there is some confusion here.

You say you tested motion triggering the central deterrent light on the LSU model and compared it to the 2 illumination lights on the LU model, but these perform different functions so should not be compared.

The 2 outer LEDs on the LSU model should also be the same warmer illumination LEDs as the LU model, so the LSU model should be configured for the warm LEDs to come on the same way as the LU model and then have the flashing central deterrent LED come on with event triggers.

I compared two very similar models in their functionality for this given task. As I understand it, the two warm LEDs on the LSU model cannot be set to turn on from events per JB1970's comment above, so I'm not sure what better comparison could be made. If I downgrade the firmware of my LSU to the 5.7.2 version, are you saying that I can get the other function back?

Using the LSU model makes more sense in scenarios where the warm lights are going to stay on all night and then the extra bright central light stands out against the warm light like in this demo video.

Given that they were the same price for non-OEM models for me, I figured I'd go with the LSU ones in hopes that one day I could utilize the Hikvision's 2 way audio standard from some open source tool - Frigate I believe has a working proof of concept for some models.

___

So, should I try downgrading the firmware on the LSU model like on the LU? I thought per the above comment that it wouldn't matter.

Thanks.

Edit: I found some spare time somehow and went ahead and downgraded to the correct build of 5.7.2 on the LSU, it has the option! I'm presuming it works fine with the two warm LEDs but I haven't actually tested it yet. Perhaps you were speaking of something else in your above comment, @JB1970?